BFP Rewards What kind of DAILY quests would you prefer as main BFP source?

[Kubik]

Before you ask, yes I read that thread, but these are more of an chievements than daily quests.

Giving out BFP only based on play time, and only in limited amount on weekly bases is the most fair option of these, because everyone get the same amount of BFP and will have no gap between skilled players and new players in regards to BFP gain.

On the other hand rewarding only victories and based on difficulty will give big advantage to veteran players that know the game and can start expert maps quickly.

 

We are not going to use result of this poll unless we want to, we are interested in opinions, we take them to consideration, but we do not need to follow the majority!

 

There seem to be missunderstanding with "or play that map for at least Y minutes to get significantly reduced reward (50%)" it mean that if you play at least Y minutes and lose not win you can take 50% of reward

Edited July 21, 2019 by Kubik

[thesikaleon]

Just find a way so people like me who are interested just for PvP won't be forced to play PvE, thank you

[McLongDickson]

don`t forget good rewards for pvp and yea definitly daily not weekly quest... and of course win this map on expert give more reward, why not.

Edited July 21, 2019 by McLongDickson

[jokersjokes]

Win before min X, and you get more. Has positive psychological effects. + Daily, so people don't get bored.

[Sheepmonster]

21 minutes ago, thesikaleon said:

Just find a way so people like me who are interested just for PvP won't be forced to play PvE, thank you

Well the opposite goes for me. I would much prefer to get all rewards in PvE than being forced to play PvP

[Kubik]

Do not worry about PvP right now, there is separate plan for that.

50% reward is not meant to be negative, but in case player lose, but was trying long enough to be rewarded at least partially for his/her time, new players can have high lose rate and that would allow them to pick reward even without a win.

[Cocofang]

Missions should be as broad and general as possible so that every thinkable playstyle (PvE, PvP, solo, duo, etc.) can complete them. People shouldn't be required to play specific maps, modes, cards or whatever. Also be careful with a time requirement. The current video game market is getting oversaturated with "games as a service" that all tout for players time and everyone wants people to sink their freetime into their game so they can have more opportunities to shove microtransactions in everyone's face. I don't think you want to enter into this competition, so the required amount of playtime should be generously low.

For purely cosmetic achievements on the other hand, that are just there for bragging rights, I think you can go as specialized as you like.

There could be a small incentive to play harder content. Just a tiny bonus so that pushing to difficult maps is a tad more rewarding. Overdo that and it would create a big imbalance between players.

[indubitablement]

I would love if everyone got the same quest everyday. For example: win Blight expert (100 bfp). That way it incentivise playing different map and we can find people to play these maps even with our smallish community.

[MrXLink]

DETAILED DESCRIPTION ON WHAT THIS POLL IS ABOUT, ITS IMPORTANCE AND ITS REASON:

Just to elaborate on this discussion in general, we are currently NOT looking at how you're going to earn BFP specifically, that's something that's already in the making for the future and will involve the opportunity for every player to at least earn some BFP when it comes to their preferred game mode. We will always strive for creating a progression system in which we both promote varied gameplay and show all of the game's options and potential, while not forcing players to do so by nullifying their BFP gain otherwise. We'll make sure that regardless of your quests, you will always have the option to gain a substantial amount of the max daily BFP you can get in the way you prefer to. 

This discussion is meant to get a general overview of what you, the community, think should be the main sources of BFP income in as general a way as possible. This is of huge influence to the game as it not only dictates the overall progression, but it also essentially controls the market and defines which players become dominant when it comes to personal wealth. It is important to know the following when considering your vote:

Be reminded that we currently have two currencies in Skylords Reborn

• Gold, a non-tradable, farmable currency that is fully player-controlled and gained based on skill, victory and to an extent playtime
• BFP, a tradable, highly influential currency that is regulated and defines the overall progression and rate of access to game content across the entire community

Regulation of BFP is important as it will prevent players with e.g. more time on their hands to get too far ahead of others, or could establish hardcore dominance over casual players when it comes to the Auction House or even general card trade. Since we have no set prices for cards and want to establish a free market (it's an enjoyable feature of the game!), BFP gain is an extremely sensitive subject. If you establish a system in which victories and hard game mode completion reward more BFP, you essentially divide the community rapidly between veterans/high-skill players/exploiters and casual/busy/infrequent players. Not only does this happen sooner than you may anticipate, but it can also lead to a sense of unfairness, inequality and a lack of control caused by real-life factors players have no say in (such as schedules, work, personal capabilities, and so on). 

Of course it's not fair to assume that everyone's entire game should progress at the same rate; if you're skilled you can expect increased progression over others, and this is currently already done through gold and potentially through prestige/NG+ possibilities in the future (a topic for another day), and the big issue in this debate is whether to carry that power on through BFP. Just be reminded that BFP is the single most influential factor within the entire game and can tip the game environment over with even the slightest of changes.

The originally proposed and still greatly considered way to earn BFP was by introducing a combination of quests and playtime rewards, with a soft-cap system implemented. This would mean that players could gain BFP just for playing matches and get even more BFP for completing quests, and would not leave those with more time and/or effort in their games feel left out (also preventing some farming abuse). A soft-cap would mean that for a relatively low amount of playtime per day, players could gain a relatively big amount of BFP, and once this time threshold had been met these rewards would decrease, but not diminish. This gives low-time players a good BFP income without having to worry they miss out on too much extra BFP for not having time, yet those with more time would not be left in the dark and still gain some amount of BFP. This way, BFP would be well-regulated and the system would not be too sensitive to potential manipulation, control and market dominance.

The system would not benefit from victories (gold would anyway), so that especially in the PvP sector of the game it would not be demotivating to lose games and you will not be punished for playing badly when it comes to the primary way of acquiring game content. A small victory bonus could be provided (though not the original plan), but was not meant to be significant enough to establish a winner-controlled economy. Be wary that this system is still a highly viable option and is still under serious consideration! This poll, however, goes in a different direction to hypothetically establish what would be the player's views on a different scenario.

<<<General Info ends here, opinion ahead>>>

My personal opinion on all this has been complex and established throughout months if not years of thought about the game's core economy and progression systems and my general game design knowledge, so I can't honestly write my full thoughts down here, but in really summarised terms, I believe that BFP should be the factor that defines the rate and intensity of the dispersion of power between player types. To put it simply; BFP defines how much power to control the game players have and how big the gaps between newcomers, casuals, hardcores, low-time and high-time players are when it comes to this. I'm of mind that every player should have as fair and as equal an opportunity to be a part of this and to keep the game going on enjoyably as possible. A casual player that works from 9 to 5 and can only play for a short amount of time each day/week should still be able to gain a good amount of BFP, keep up with the general speed of other players, and partake in a free and fluid trading environment. Similarly, I wholeheartedly believe that nobody should feel like they're being hindered when it comes to BFP gain by losses or simply not managing to complete a map or fighting a stronger opponent, and so I think that BFP gain should not be influenced by this. 

I do believe that completing harder maps and winning games should be rewarded, and what is mostly overlooked is that this is already happening in the form of gold and upgrades, which even allows skilled players to quickly get ahead of their game and progress faster on their own accord, without massively impacting other players due to the non-trade nature of gold and upgrades, unlike BFP, which would have a bigger, more direct impact on everyone else. 

Therefore I'm advocating for the original system that has been proposed and thought through years ago (see above), in which as little players as possible should feel left behind, casuals have a good chance to catch up or stay within their game, hardcores/high-time players still can get some sort of an edge if they would want to, and the currency flow can be more easily regulated must the situation get out of hand. Though I would find a small victory bonus acceptable middle-ground terms, I do generally not recommend it. This doesn't mean I don't want to reward skilled players, I just sincerely believe they already are rewarded and it is not necessary to pose a risk for the already sensitive BFP system.

Similarly, leaderboard rewards could also widen this gap, and while I'm not as sceptical about this due to the fixed time in which leaderboard rewards would be handed out (e.g. every month), leaderboard accuracy is currently at risk if we want to implement frequent (balancing) patches in the future, and I don't think it's a good idea to hand out rewards to leaderboard entries that might be based on exploits or serious balancing concerns. This is a different, more complex situation I do not currently feel safe about involving in a process as influential as BFP gain.

I strive for quests that are achievable by everyone if they want to and promote variety in-game, and I do by no means want playtime and quests to be the same thing; playtime should be a separate BFP track and quests should too. Having quests renew/stack daily would in my opinion be beneficial to maintain a healthy, more active playerbase with more games open and a generally better experience with less risk of the game dying out after weeklies have been fulfilled, and it will not be detrimental to frequent but low-time players.

I hope you can take this information and these thoughts in mind when you vote, and be reminded that this poll is by no means binding and will just give us some insights on the other side of the BFP-coin for now. Thank you so much for taking the effort to read this and we look forward to seeing what you think.

[Cocofang]

As you stated, players with a lot of time naturally have the ability to progress faster already. The balance is definitely delicate but also considering that the size of the community will be quite small and imbalances could be felt even more severely, I would err on the side of caution. Keeping things as accessible and even as possible.

Also, leaving things on the table always feels bad and frustrating. So I think the diminishing returns of investing more time should definitely be noticeable.

[DieBieneMaya]

oh wow

1. i like the System like its now ,

2. worktimes : i Need to stand up 05.00 AM , driving 0600 @ work until 06.00 PM , driving home 1 hr , , with human neededs i only have About 1 hr time to Play per day !

so do Weekly quest for reward , like Play 210 minutes in any gamemode , or win map x , y , z map (not on a specific day )

and not everyone is able to beat every map on highest difficultys ! even with a good deck !

[Epic]

Why would you Change the actually reward?

I like the acutally reward System. because you only Need to Play 30 min for a Booster and you can reroll the bfps if ist too hard! and for rpve 6 ist for all possible too beat!

 

plz dont Change this ;)

greetz

[Fayded]

Tried thinking about this one tons, since you've brought the game back, and will say again, thank you for reviving this gem of a game.

It won't bother me how the progression system turns out either way, I can enjoy solo or coops with the basic starter cards we get: giant thanks for the mostly solid starter set.
As long as progression is at least as good as it is now, the game is completely playable and doesn't damage its long term value. Just tossing a few instance based idea suggestions!

MMOs have a 'Rested bonus'! Shouldn't be hard to do something similar.
Daily: Play time based reward like usual 30 minutes a day. With 1 stored extra play time daily (if you didn't finish yesterday) and reductions for missed play time.
(adjust it with a weekly timer subtraction, subtracts 5 minutes from the daily if you didn't play yesterday
10 minutes if you haven't played in 2 days, and stores up to 30 minutes of *daily consecutive reductions*?
e.g. -10 min to the timer, for 3 days in a row, if you havent played for a week!)

Essentially this idea basically means, if you didn't complete your 30min daily for w/e reason, you get a 25 or a 20 minute daily! Also being able to hold over 2, 30 minute dailies isn't a bad idea either, if I don't play for several days because of a busy week it'd be nice to see 2, 20 minute dailies on the weekend for at least a decent reward. Or 2 dailies (for a total of 55 minutes) if I didn't play yesterday. This concept's basis is to consider that players who do play daily, will guarantee an advantage, 14.2% per day of a total weekly payout for daily players. Backstocking a missed daily through a week at least provides almost 30% of the total possible weekly reward.

Daily quests (either PVP or Coops, no forced PVP or PVE)
Those daily types should probably just be 'any campaign, PVE 6 or harder, or PVP quest', maybe 2x per day? (1 Solo or multiplayer, 1 multiplayer required?)

Quest completion counter (keeps a running tally of all these quests you've completed, providing bonus packs at specific intervals)
Already a standard, and not a bad idea, it works fantastic as an overall progress condition, maybe gets a bit steep when your far in though.

Proposed Suggestion: Another secondary running tally counter, like the completion counter, every 10 missions (PVE6, Campaign, or PVP)
that you complete, rewards you with a singular common card from a unique (custom commons only) booster set.

By offering 1 free common for the completion of every 10 missions (not quests, but any mission meeting the same requirements) common cards will have low prices by ensuring the common cards are just that, common. This suggestion revolves around several ideas, ease for new players to purchase common units and spell cards they'll need reducing any shortages, players that continue playing after completing the dailies have a basic incentive to continue enjoying the game, even if its not huge or highly profitable. This suggestion also avoids providing an additional BFP directly to players who play for too long causing any large negative impact on BFP production.

Don't figure I mean to tell you how to make or balance the game, I'm just happy to see and play it again, just thought this one through for awhile and figured I'd offer the ideas, even they don't get implemented. Thanks for letting us enjoy this classic again.

Edited July 22, 2019 by Fayded

[Upoo]

I think this way ... (And I hope you do not throw stones at me for this) the text in parentheses is a saying that we use a lot in Brazil, I hope it does not sound very strange.
I believe that the rewards should be "equal", not to benefit many newcomers and also not to benefit the more experienced.

In spite of the fact that the novices "need" more boosters in the beginning of the game because they do not have so many letters. These should not acquire a greater amount than those who are already in the game the longest and battling daily.

On the other hand, those who have played for a long time and are "experienced" should not benefit from this either, since they have been playing for a longer time and are more likely to complete more difficult challenges and obtain better rewards for this.

In this way, I believe that the rewards should be equal for everyone, with the extra for victory (SMALL) just as an extra bonus.

An example of a change to the rewards, I believe the daily playing 30 minutes to win a booster, should be modified.

One way to change it would be as follows:
Keep the 30-minute reward as the booster, however, for every 15 minutes thrown after this 30 requirement, add a prize to the player. Limiting the rewards after 2 hours of play.

Nothing extraordinary, but something that keeps the player interested in continuing to play, and from this were he could play whatever he liked. Be PVP, PVE, rbg, or whatever.

As a daily mission, just win "x" maps, or play "x" matches.
This would be the right kind of mission to come every day, nothing that would force anyone to do something they did not like.

I hope my point has been clear. It is not easy to try to argue using a language that you are not fluent in.

[Kubik]

7 minutes ago, Upoo said:

As a daily mission, just win "x" maps, or play "x" matches.
This would be the right kind of mission to come every day, nothing that would force anyone to do something they did not like. 

So you prefer BFP/Boosters only for time? What reward you imagine for these?

[Upoo]

9 minutes ago, Kubik said:

So you prefer BFP/Boosters only for time? What reward you imagine for these?

Not necessarily, I believe we should be limited (to 1 booster per day as a reward), just as it has been done as a reward for playing 30 minutes.
 
However, I believe that this reward could be improved, so I suggested the following:
"One way to change it would be as follows:
Keep the 30-minute reward for the booster, however, for every 15 minutes thrown after this 30 requirement, add a prize to the player. Limiting the rewards after 2 hours of play. "
This additional reward up to 2 hours should be BFP.

As for the part of the text that made the quote, was my suggestion as to the daily missions, which I believe should not force players to do something they do not like, so I suggested that it be "win x maps" or " play x matches ". For this type of mission we can all complete, without anyone being benefited, whether new or experienced.
And as for the rewards of these daily missions, I believe they could be the way it's been done, 50-75 BFP, or even a small amount (if the first suggestion were to be taken, which would increase the reward on a whole).

[budders024]

I like the idea of every day you have the ability to get one booster and the possibility to get enough bfp to get another booster using bfp if all quests are completed including a win map x this gives more objectives for the day as opposed to just 3 quests and two booster possibility per day would be nice especially since prices fluxuate and go up and down in the market. As people are able to get more cards this will make it easier for the beginner to play with the pros and keeps everyone happy you could make it so the quests take a total of two or more hours to complete so you still have people playing for periods of time.

 

 

 

Edited July 23, 2019 by budders024

[Raxaaa]

higher rewards on wins and difficult maps would reward players with lucky boosters. those who were not so lucky gets it even harder.

flaming when you join a lobby with lower decklevel...

i don´t know. i don´t care. happy that i am not a new player anymore. i would find my way^^

[mbored]

The fact that that many people want to get twice the reward for doing expert maps and further leaderboard rewards is so greedy and funny. There is maps that can be speedrun and some people want to farm them to get a significant advantage over novice players and people more focused in PvP. I see Kubic has made a response saying they are interested in opinions and wont necessarily implement the most popular poll result, but I just want to say that the people voting for that with the intent to more or less abuse it along with the early re-release marketplace rare card prices to just stack money should be ashamed of themselves. 

[DarcReaver]

2 hours ago, mbored said:

The fact that that many people want to get twice the reward for doing expert maps and further leaderboard rewards is so greedy and funny. There is maps that can be speedrun and some people want to farm them to get a significant advantage over novice players and people more focused in PvP. I see Kubic has made a response saying they are interested in opinions and wont necessarily implement the most popular poll result, but I just want to say that the people voting for that with the intent to more or less abuse it along with the early re-release marketplace rare card prices to just stack money should be ashamed of themselves. 

Minorities are usually overpresent in any kind of public internet vote because they have a higher percentage of participants compared to other groups. Solely listening on thse votes is a bad idea because of that. 

About the daily rewards: 

Just as another option: How about adding the "get a free common card" for a "win of the day" quest? 

Edited August 9, 2019 by DarcReaver

[LEBOVIN]

9 hours ago, DarcReaver said:

Minorities are usually overpresent in any kind of public internet vote because they have a higher percentage of participants compared to...

There are currently only like 12 active people present in the leaderboards. Yet there are more votes.

[ShadowUsagi]

Thanks a lot for the great effort

Edited August 16, 2019 by ShadowUsagi

[Kyoji]

I would think that a simple daily play X could incorporate everyone. I know once everything resets we will all be back at square one, however, longevity of a game depends on bringing in new blood and specific missions would reduce incentive for a new player to get started as it's currently difficult enough to get a steady flow of BFP whereby you actually feel like you are "growing" in a positive way. It's also why I think not only expert but advanced missions should reward more BFP than standard missions to compensate for the time necessary to complete the maps.

I would say the largest drawback for me at the moment is honestly the inability to purchase BFP and packs. The BFP you get from daily missions seems tedious and forces me into grinding daily missions to earn BFP. It was never liked much in MMORPGs and I don't like it here. They are fine to reward people for going above and beyond to min/max their earnings but shouldn't be the baseline set for how much BFP is reasonable for one to earn.

Everything as it is leaves me wanting more. More packs and more to do than to login for 45 minutes get my discounted pack and log off. The 20ish BFP I get for a map isn't worth the effort. I would rather decrease the daily mission rewards from 75/50 BFP to 50/25 and would rather like to see the base gain from a standard mission (because we will all need to farm for our upgrades) increased from the average 20 whatever to 35 which would require 13 standard maps to get a pack which is more reasonable than 21-22 maps needed which is simply absurd. Advanced missions should reward around 45 which requires 10 maps and expert should give 55 which is at 8 maps.

If you are deadset on preventing people from getting ahead of others which isn't unreasonable then I would then you could simply limit the number of packs purchasable per day to 2 which means you can earn BFP and store it but your progress is capped. This allows some of us working folks to play hard on the weekends to makeup for the loss of playtime during the weekdays. So I can farm BFP hard on the days I can and not fall too far behind due to daily missions being a large source of BFP.

The largest contention is how fast someone can progress, but comparing a speed running expert to standard players is apples to oranges. If you want to slow people down then hardcap packs purchasable a day or apply a growth to packs purchased so the first pack every day is 450 then 500 then 550, etc. 

Edited October 15, 2020 by Kyoji

[Ladadoos]

7 hours ago, Kyoji said:

The 20ish BFP I get for a map isn't worth the effort. I would rather decrease the daily mission rewards from 75/50 BFP to 50/25 and would rather like to see the base gain from a standard mission (because we will all need to farm for our upgrades) increased from the average 20 whatever to 35 which would require 13 standard maps to get a pack which is more reasonable than 21-22 maps needed which is simply absurd. Advanced missions should reward around 45 which requires 10 maps and expert should give 55 which is at 8 maps.

You don't earn BFP for winning a map, you gain BFP by spending time in matches. More matches does not equal more BFP. I am also not sure where you are pulling "20 BFP" from. Furthermore, your statement about requiring 10-20+ matches for an extra booster misses the point. The daily BFP rewards (which are different from the daily quests), consists of the daily boost and the reserves. With the daily boost (250BFP) + 2 quests (150BFP) you can buy whatever booster you wish with the booster discount. The reserves is and was not meant to give you an option to buy an extra booster. It is simply there to give you some BFP if you decide to play a lot more.  At one point many more achievements will be added too, which gives players another reason to play more (or differently, rewards players for playing more).

Edited October 15, 2020 by Ladadoos

[Kyoji]

2 hours ago, Ladadoos said:

You don't earn BFP for winning a map, you gain BFP by spending time in matches. More matches does not equal more BFP. I am also not sure where you are pulling "20 BFP" from. Furthermore, your statement about requiring 10-20+ matches for an extra booster misses the point. The daily BFP rewards (which are different from the daily quests), consists of the daily boost and the reserves. With the daily boost (250BFP) + 2 quests (150BFP) you can buy whatever booster you wish with the booster discount. The reserves is and was not meant to give you an option to buy an extra booster. It is simply there to give you some BFP if you decide to play a lot more.  At one point many more achievements will be added too, which gives players another reason to play more (or differently, rewards players for playing more).

Ah I was mistaken then about how it was earned. The 20 BFP I got was a general number I found reoccurring from spamming PvE maps well after the daily boost was gone. Can I ask why the idea of slowing progression to one pack a day was decided? It sounds counter-intuitive to encouraging play in a multiplayer game. Not that I want to criticize but I would like to understand more of the logic so I can formulate better responses in the future.