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Dexirian

System Administrator (Retired)
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  1. Dexirian liked a post in a topic by Zyna in Patch #400022 - 01 January 2021   
    Patch #400022
    Greetings Skylords, Skyladies, and Skyfolks,

    This update contains our first balance patch for the game and a minor fix, enjoy! Feedback to these changes can be given on the balancing discord. When you give feedback make sure to properly support your reasoning by including replays or video footage, otherwise it is not very helpful.

    General fixes
    Fixed wrong amount of gained ELO displayed after a ranked PvP match. General changes
    Added the option to select the reward distribution mode also for single player campaign. Card changes
    A detailed list of all balancing changes can be found on the wiki: https://skylords-reborn.fandom.com/wiki/Patches#Patch_.23400022
    Hotfix
    Added missing ability "Accelerated Construction" to Northstar. The first upgrade was changed from "-5 construction time" to "-10 construction time" and the second upgrade was changed from "-5 construction time" to "-10 energy cost", and the energy cost was increased for the card at level 0 and 1. Reverted accidental increase of tunneling ability with Deep One and Burrower. Fixed [missing english text] ability for Stonekin Tempest (Purple) ability. Fixed an issue with Gemeye (Green) where the paralyze ability did not apply anymore.
  2. Dexirian liked a post in a topic by RadicalX in Current Proposal: PvP Rewards (AOT rPvE)   
    Hello MrXLink,
    First of all thanks for making this thread. I'm really convinced that a remarkable part of the PvP community would benefit from higher gold incomes and it can clearly enhance the overall game environment. Sorry for the upcoming wall of text, but I really need to talk about this topic!
     
    Current PvP Values 
    I would like to start with some basics about the current reward system and potential problems. So let's get into the current formulas to check current rewards (They should be accurate as I double checked my calculations with gold incomes in some of my own games).  
     
    1. Winning player
    During the interval [0;2] the gold reward is at flat 250. 
    During the interval [2;20] the amount of gold f(t) get's calculated as a function of time (t=minutes) -> f(t) = 250+((t-2)/18 * 1100) 
    After 20 minutes the gold cap of 1350 got reached and it won't get higher regardless of gametime. I assume this is done to prevent abuse of 2 people agreeing on completely afk'ing in the game. 
     
    2. Losing Player
    During the interval [0;2] the gold reward is a flat 100.
    During the interval [2;20] the amount of gold f(t) get's calculated as a function of time (t=minutes) again -> f(t) = 100+((t-2)/18*400)
    After 20 minutes the gold cap of flat 500 got reached. 
     
    What does this exactly mean? I'll show some rounded GPM values at 5 relevant game spots throughout the game for some clarity. 2, 5, 10 and 20, 30 minutes marks will be used here.
    time -> Winning player (Losing player) [50% wr player]
    2min -> 125 GPM (50 GPM) [88GPM]
    5min -> 87 GPM (33 GPM) [60GPM]
    10min -> 74 GPM (28 GPM) [51 GPM]
    20min -> 68 GPM (25 GPM) [47 GPM]
    30min -> 45 GPM (17 GPM) [31 GPM]
    Comparison: I'll take your rPvE 9 value from one of your previous posts for that (145GPM). This implies that our average rPvE player aproximatly needs 29 minutes on average to win one map. Given that I think the average game time is faster, but there is no 100% winrate for all of these players that may be a quite accurate value. The average player in PvP has a 50% winrate in a normally distributed PvP environment. I'm pretty sure it isn't given (players with avg. skill should sit at sub 50% winrates), but I hope some gold changes may motivate more players to step into action again to fix that matchmaking problem. Anyways, these numbers lead to some problems I see with the current system and make me think that just raw stat increases won't be the solution to the issue. 
     
    The big problems I see right now
    -> GPM constantly decreases with increased game time. 
    -> Winning PvP (highly skilled) is getting compared to average rPvE times (moderately skilled)
    -> Losing income is really low, which is very counterintuitive for new players
     
    The constant decrease of GPM over time is a problem for balancing. If you straight up increase GPM values on by putting in a multiplicator onto the formula you end up promoting the easiest way of abusing the game which is straight AFK'ing & wintrading. An AFK player will always be finished off after 2-4 minutes. If GPM are at their peak during this time this is a problem for potenial buffs to gold rewards. The question about rewarding 30min games over 20min games is another discussion (maybe you could check the percentage of 30min PvP games, if that is possible for you). From my perspective I would set a soft cap for these last 10 minutes rather than stopping at 20min. If equally skilled players face off against each other in certain matchups games tend to last much longer than average PvP games once the players reach higher tech stages. 
    Another problem I see with most arguments is that the PvP Winner gets compared to the average rPvE player. I would consider myself pretty experienced in rPvE, but not top tier. I still get to finish 4 rPvE 9's in an hour. This puts me at a GPM of 280, which is completely out of the range of what I would achieve with my current 92% PvP winrate even in the proposed improved system. This is something that really should be put into consideration when talking about these calculations. 
     
    Matchmaking issues
    So let's talk a little about this problem beforehand. Right now GPM are vastly decreased by high que times and a very high participation of Top 10/20 players in ranked games resulting in que times. I really hope that after the upcoming reset and potential improvements to the PvP environment it may be possible to overcome some of these issues. With more motivated PvP players there would be a higher gold outcome for everyone as it minimizes the loss through que times. When talking about values it should always be considered, that the gold loss during waiting times has a clear implication onto the true outcome. That said I don't want to include this inconsistent variable too much into my arguments.  
     
    Abuse of strong gold incomes 
    Let's talk about it as you emphasized potential abuse as an issue. I don't think it is possible to abuse the system in a way, where it ruins game experience for serious players. If a change manages to make PvP interesting enough to attract abusers it will attract more serious players aswell, which has a much greater positive impact onto the PvP scene. There are 2 ways of abusing a high gold outcome for PvP:
     
    1. Que up and stay AFK
    2. Try to delay the game as much as possible
     
    For the first case, this may be a delay of 2 minutes. Finishing off an AFK is an easy task, should be done in less than 2 minutes and grants some valuable gold. I don't think anyone will be too sad about a free win. Since there is a report system nowadays you could also just threaten to ban people that are doing such things. The second case I mentioned is doable aswell. People that try to delay by turteling or running away will run out of gas pretty quickly. Mass towers allow early free wells that result in a fast T3 finish while running away without ressource generation will also be a death sentence, since ressource generation just works through immobile buildings, that can get targeted directly.  
    Sure there may be different ways to abuse the system to get gold with a friend, but that doesn't ruin the game experience for anyone as you won't participate in these matches. Even with an increased gold income for PvP it will never get close to certain abuse strategies. You could also team up with a friend in dwarfen riddle expert to let him solo the map. You can make some food during this time and get a 500 (?) GPM value for that. Soultree is also an option to boost gold incomes into different levels in case you are a solo player. Unless PvP rewards for losing players start being competive to 
     
    What are my goals?
    Before I start talking about real numbers, I want to talk about long term goals. Overall I want to see an attractive game with enjoyable gameplay for the majority of players in all gamemodes. I think the PvP community right now is quite small, but this wasn't always the case. During early 2013 times we had a very strong community and a strong PvP environment. 
     
    1. Better new player experience (increased rewards for losing players that tried their best)
    2. The possibility for veterans to grind without spamming PvE 
     
    I'm convinced, that the amount of people that would try out PvP within a much more begginerfriendly environment gets a little underestimated in general. A more consistent income would increase the ability to get decks and cards, that you see in your first games, where you surely end up getting crushed. But with a quicker removal of competitive discrepance through ressources you can start learning the game much faster and enjoy its beauty when the real PvP gameplay starts. Under equal conditions it is much easier to identify mistakes and improve. At that point the wins start to come in which brings in more motivation to go on.  
     
    So the next thing I'm talking about is also about the veterans, that used to play PvP during 2013. I think the majority of people in the PvP community do want to achieve their first playable PvP deck within one month of active gameplay. To get the big picture that means 170.000-260.000 gold depending on the faction you want to play. Sure you somewhat can start playing seriously with some cards being on U2, but I made the estimation, this value may probably the difference, that my final modell doesn't catch due to the loss of gold through que times. With a GPM of 125 this would range from 22-35 hours. Looks bearable for the cheaper decks, but keep in mind only the best players do have winrates above 80% over many games and I used the winner values here. Average values of 125 for winning and 35 for losing imply a 80GPM for 50% winrate players. Back to 35-54 hours of raw gameplay for the first deck again. But without a competive deck the winrate will most likely be lower than 50% at the start even as a veteran. A state where grinding for a deck still isn't worth it.
     
    Sparring grounds
    Not much I can add here. The potential for abuse is very high, but no rewards at all aren't satisfying especially for people who are afraid of ranked and the ones who want to get practice beforehand. Setting up a low percentage based on ranked income seems like a good solution for me. 
     
     
    What changes I would like to see
    The gold value I would like to see for a reasonable grind would be the possibility for people to get an upgraded PvP deck in about one month of gameplay. If we say Mr. XYZ plays 1 hour on average each day, this means we "ideally" do have 30 hours of gameplay. A full deck roughly costs 200.000 gold on average. In order to achieve that, we would need 111 GPM. An average player shouldn't earn less than that if PvP should end up in a reasonable state in terms of gold gains. 
    The second value that I use to adjust my final proposal is the rPvE average value of 145 GPM. If an average PvP player ends up earning more than that, PvP might get vulnerable to that. So I would like to see an average GPM between 111 and 145. This would push PvP into a position where it still gets outshined by rPvE and especially cPvE, but may be able to bring some satisfaction to the people, that simply don't enjoy playing PvE. 
    So let's try to get to the final formula. AFK players shouldn't be rewarded here, so flat loss income for the first 2 minutes should stay the same, while the flat bonus for the winning party could get increased by a little bit. It's less vulnerable to abuse and brings more excitement to very dominant games and decreases potential frustration upon facing an afk player. 
    I decided to keep the income between 20 and 30 minutes for now in my modell. It could see a slight change in the future, but for now it should affect the lowest percentage of games.
    My model also brings rewards for the losing player, that ended up putting a long fight. Unless the enemy manipulates the game aswell no abuser will last long in these games and I really think PvP needs to be much more beginnerfriendly than it is right now. 
     
    Final formula and comparison to initial values and other game modes 
    Winning player:
    [0;2] -> f(t) = 300
    [2;20] -> f(t) = 300+((t-2)/18*3200)
    [20;30] -> f(t) = 3500
     
    Losing player: 
    [0;2] -> f(t) = 100
    [2;20] -> f(t) = 100 + ((t-2)/18*1700)
    [20;30] -> f(t) = 1800
     
    Gold income comparison by using the marks of 2, 5, 10, 20 and 30 minutes
    time -> Winning player (losing player) [50% wr player]
    2min -> 150 GPM (50GPM) [100 GPM]
    5min -> 167 GPM (77GPM) [122 GPM]
    10min -> 172 GPM (86 GPM) [129 GPM]
    20min -> 175 GPM (90 GPM) [133 GPM]
    30min -> 117 GPM (60 GPM) [88,5 GPM]
     
    These GPM values are what I would look for. It would be possible to farm upgrades for an entire deck within a month and a decent PvP player still gains below avg rPvE values while high lvl PvP player are still out of contention with PvE speedrunners.  
     
    TL DR;
    -> Increased scaling for losing players by 240% 
    -> Increased flat winner bonus for winning games during the first 2 minutes (150% -> 200%)
    -> Decreased gold over time multiplicator for winners (175% -> 88%)
    -> GPM for an average PvP player will roughly stay 15% lower than the average rPvE player
    -> GPM for a high ranked PvP player will roughly stay 70% lower than a top rPvE player
     
    Thanks alot for reading and I really hope, that the PvP community can come back strong again! If there is anything you want to talk about, I'll be around for discussion 
    Best regards,
    RadicalX
  3. Dexirian liked a post in a topic by BurningWorld in Janis Joplin's Reincarnation?   
    Sounds more like Joe Cocker too me than Janis Joplin haha but still she's good indeed!
  4. BurningWorld liked a post in a topic by Dexirian in Janis Joplin's Reincarnation?   
    Holy mother of god this girl is my new favorite singer
     
     
     
  5. Fauchderial liked a post in a topic by Dexirian in Introducing... Ultrakool, our new Moderator!   
    Welcome to the dark side
  6. ForgeUrPath liked a post in a topic by Dexirian in Introducing... Ultrakool, our new Moderator!   
    Welcome to the dark side
  7. Dexirian liked a post in a topic by InsaneHawk in Patreon - Thank List   
    Hello Skylords,

    Here's the list of all our actual Patrons, thank you all for your support ♥ We'll make sure to make this project a reality in long-term thanks to all of you!
    Also, I'm pointing out that we do have a full track of who's pledge is either activated, validated or not. So this list does represent people that are still validated on Patreon.
    OUR PATREON PAGE
    https://www.patreon.com/skylordsreborn
     
    ACTIVE PATRONS:
    Abdullah
    Abel Silva
    Adam Kinnaird
    Ailin's Lab
    Alex
    Alexander Kuziak
    Alexis Cheynas
    Azura
    Bartłomiej Podress-Leszek
    Ben Moskovitch
    Blashyrkh
    Caleb Segura
    Christian
    Christoph Pumplün
    darthnif
    David Rager
    David Velic
    Dominic Rothenfluh
    Dylan
    Erik Meyer Johansen
    Erik Schwarz
    Fabian Hoffmeister
    Fabian Tryba
    Fliggmode
    fred
    George
    guggelfunsus
    Hintil
    Hynium
    Icrine Arcura
    IDonZalog
    Illuminati
    Ivan Mrvelj
    Ivo Bonev
    Jakub Theimer
    Jan-Martin Heidrich
    Jefitor Caetano
    Jens Ising
    jimmy Garnier
    Jonathan Frank
    jonathan mindeguia
    Just
    Justin Ball
    Karlo Kis
    Khoa Le
    Killbuster
    Kiritos
    Ko557
    Laurence Evans
    Laurien Theinl
    Leo Hedrick
    Leo Semm
    Louai Jabou
    Luc C
    Lucas Wilke
    Lyri.c
    Magnamuz
    Manu Ristola
    Marc E.
    marcopt1
    Mario Urbancic
    Markus Brenzinger
    Matej Oberlender
    Maximilian Brauer
    Maximilian Falke
    Maximilian Roth
    Mexxman01
    Michael Leman
    Michi Büchlr
    Moritz Weissenberger
    MrBao
    Muhammad-Adam Al-Sawad
    n3tax
    Nico Neinhardt
    Nil98
    Pariah
    Patrick
    Patryk Wierzbicki
    paul schaz
    Pavel Kacálek
    Phil Ma
    plasmasloth
    Ponni
    Prajoss
    Pro Bugger
    Quentin Olivier
    Raymond Ritschka
    Richard Krasky
    Robert Sinar
    robin Hagios
    Roma Gerasimenko
    Rondine
    royce rutherford
    Ruben ten Cate
    Sander Boogaard
    ShadowRoA
    Sharien Radaik
    ShinyBlue
    Simon Eriksson
    Sir Volin
    SirChomp
    StachinoCZ
    Stefan Behrens
    Steven
    Sztrehoszki Attila
    Takis Kopanellis
    tdx4ned
    Thadeus
    Thomas
    Thomas 'Kranodor' Hahn
    Thomas Hochgatterer
    Tim Mrfka
    Timk Ma
    Tobias Beitz
    Tobias Gorny
    Tri
    Valdan
    Vithran-TOG-
    Walker Rudolf
    Weathnarh
    Wout van Aken
    xFireFox
    Yaroslav Dronskiy
    Zerologia
    Zophiel

    FORMER PATRONS:
    Abid Mares
    Adrian
    Alessandro Toni
    Alexmor
    Andreas Schiele
    Andrey Kuznetsov
    Battzock
    Bo_Hellgren
    Boris Golikov
    Brian Fay
    Bruno Lüthi
    Bruti
    Christopher Joseph Frost
    Daniel Alexandre de Sousa Rodrigues
    Darklorden
    De Ruijt Official
    Dominykas
    Douglas dos Santos Cintra Machado
    Elwyn Viel
    Elwyn viel
    Eric Reisch
    Fabio Pistis
    Fatale Stoned
    florin laurentiu neata
    idan jones
    Itay Kaduri
    Jack Hinton
    Jacob
    Jacob Kevin
    Jakub Kowalczyk
    Jannik Schneider
    Jerome Ethenoz
    Jesper Andersson
    Josiah Mahar
    José Carlos Albano
    Kade Pilgrim
    Kevin Desternes
    killbis
    KIPKIP
    Krunoslav Jerkan
    Lab Stephane
    lafond
    Leonardo Lovatto Michaelsen
    Lior Hadashian
    Loriens
    Lucas Schroeder da Silva
    Marcin Jagiełło
    Mateusz Zbik
    Max Reimer
    maxence
    Maykow Borba
    Michael
    Michael Egorenkov
    Michael Sass Husum
    Michu Zetos
    Mindaugas Visockas
    Niklas Knapp
    Noel Köhler
    Panico No Face
    Pavel Lymarev
    Prieto Calero Antonio
    PSiHxD
    quisatz
    RA3EALMSHAKL
    Ricardo Nauhardt
    Robin Wiesler
    Roy Groen
    Sal'Varr
    Salenstern
    Sandro Kläntschi
    Sebastian Skrok
    sebastien villeneuve
    Steckwurstking
    Stefano Donati
    Syledric
    Teddy Dumont
    TheSunrad .
    Thomas Lemoine
    Thomas Smit
    Thomas Stoller
    Timo Waeber
    Timothy Florek
    UpinSmoke
    Vbv Vbnvnbvbn
    VECK
    William Vad
    Xhovani Precetaj
    Zorock Kcoroz

    (Last update : 17/10/2020- 10:41 CEST)
  8. Fauchderial liked a post in a topic by Dexirian in Wanted: Signature update or New one   
    The friend that made my signature sadly isn't in the field anymore and doesn't have time to help me out. I'd like a similar if not identical one but with Skylords instead of BFR. I'll even go as far as doing a small commission for a brand new high quality one, just give me your quote.
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