youto000 Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 yes but you must remember Rifle Cultists are 4 orb were frost mage is 1 orb the instance were a frost mage battles a Rifle Cultists the player with the Rifle Cultists will win because... well... 4 orb vs 1 orb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Treim Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 4 hours ago, anonyme0273 said: Dark Grenade. Huge range and can be fully charged before the Frost Mage gets close (on U3). On lower levels, it won't probably work. However, if you look at knockback, even Frost Mage knocks units around in a direction where 6 man squads may be spread so much, that the cone of the knockback doesn't hit them all anymore. Thus 1 Rifle Cultist may finish charging the Grenade and exploding it, killing the Frost Mage (who may not manage to micromanage well, and if it moves, it will be shot by ranged units)... or just killed by M L XL in the meantime If FM is attacking at max range and you command your rifle cultists to stand still, the archers at the back will not get attacked at some point - easy to fix with a movement command from the FM though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultrakool Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 5 hours ago, anonyme0273 said: Dark Grenade. Huge range and can be fully charged before the Frost Mage gets close (on U3). On lower levels, it won't probably work. That's what one might call a "hard counter" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loptous Posted February 17, 2016 Author Share Posted February 17, 2016 So I have noticed by looking at all the cards, is that nature has a lot of buildings. Mark of the Keeper is a very great card and for many reasons: It can counter devastating abilities, auto-cast, toggled abilities, and I believe ranged and flying attacks as well. Of course it has it's weaknesses against cards like Firedancer, melee units, etc. But can provide the player some decent time build up and gain some power. This card is a safe card to use in my opinion, something someone would use to stall out some backdoors or prepare a fight within your territory. I like this card a lot, I mean it has a timeshifter ability without the 3 orbs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ladadoos Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 I don't really have much to say besides that this card can do wonders when used and positioned correctly... Simple yet powerful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LagOps Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 i personally dislike motk, it is utterly frustrating. if you want to attack all you can do is mele units, which get countered so easyly by nature. it's far more poppular in low elo... thank god! don't be fooled, it is strong; it's just that nature splashes do have slot issues so situational cards like motk rarely get played. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Treim Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Can be an option against Lost Souls 4 player lvl 10 when getting heavy incomes from t4 and post t4 bases - like 5 treefiends, 4 lost vigils + shields and all that S and M units aint fun - if your t3 clear with Shadow Phoenix was decent though, you should be able to defend it without needing MotK - it is more like a card to increase chances of getting t3 safely. You gotta need it up when the 2nd waves of incommings are comming. You can trap the income with that pretty well generally until someone hits at least t3. Very situational but definetly worth if you can play around the card well enough and struggle with defending t3! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loptous Posted February 17, 2016 Author Share Posted February 17, 2016 42 minutes ago, LagOps said: i personally dislike motk, it is utterly frustrating. if you want to attack all you can do is mele units, which get countered so easyly by nature. it's far more poppular in low elo... thank god! don't be fooled, it is strong; it's just that nature splashes do have slot issues so situational cards like motk rarely get played. Yeah that's true, melee can get countered by roots and such lol never thought of that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YaBro0 Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Like LagOps said MotK is actually pretty strong in PvP. @LagOps Actually I don't think that naturesplashes have such slotproblems, you have many options but all naturesplashes do pretty good with only core cards. Many units are just nice to have and if you want to play MotK you'll definatly find a slot for it. Problem imo is that people dislike playing buildings in PvP, because bound power at the wrong spot can make huge problems. Also MotK is very situational to the map and gives you mostly advantage vs shadowplashes due to AoC and less vs fire splashes against whom you'll struggle more. But still this card is very strong and like a absolute defense in PvP but still people dislike this kind of playstyle in PvP even tho it isn't weak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaliber84 Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 One of my personal favourites. Simple and strong but you need to understand where it makes sense to place one and the intuition or knowledge to do that accurately. One of the strongest situational cards in PvE and on some maps it can do wonders. I really like how it is possible to use and abuse it even in higher tiers. Personally I always would've liked it to be slightly stronger (more HP and a tiny little bit more range) with increased orb and power cost (, 80) but that's just personal preference. IMO in T1 it is overpowered on some maps (and useless on others) and not quite as useful as I would prefer at T2 and T3. Main problem for everyone lusting after one of these already is that you need a few fitting cards beneath MotK to make it shine. WW, Shaman and Roots should be enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youto000 Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 mark of the keeper is very good for PvE like crusade but not as good in PvP or rPvE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultrakool Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 4 hours ago, YaBro0 said: Like LagOps said MotK is actually pretty strong in PvP. @LagOps Actually I don't think that naturesplashes have such slotproblems, you have many options but all naturesplashes do pretty good with only core cards. Many units are just nice to have and if you want to play MotK you'll definatly find a slot for it. Problem imo is that people dislike playing buildings in PvP, because bound power at the wrong spot can make huge problems. Also MotK is very situational to the map and gives you mostly advantage vs shadowplashes due to AoC and less vs fire splashes against whom you'll struggle more. But still this card is very strong and like a absolute defense in PvP but still people dislike this kind of playstyle in PvP even tho it isn't weak. Maybe this card could work in high ELO where a decent nature player has an idea of the right time and positioning for this tactic to work or to force a fight near the MotK but in lower ELOs I don't think this card is viable at all. It encourages turtling and in lower ELOs you could just ignore it and attack somewhere else or just take the power advantage and outwell your opponents. Could you maybe elaborate more on the idea of "absolute defence" or what this card could be played in combination with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilenceKiller99 Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Just thinking of this: If you play nature T1, and you are up against lets say fire T1. Fire T1 core units are scavenger, sunstriders, thugs, firesworn, sunderer (with eruption and maybe mortar). Lets say you play on haladur and you are fighitng for the middle wells/orb cluster. If the nature guy drops this tower, almost all of the units above would be useless... It might be hard to pull of, because of eruption while building and so on, but if you get it up, its like almost unstopable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultrakool Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 2 minutes ago, SilenceKiller99 said: Just thinking of this: If you play nature T1, and you are up against lets say fire T1. Fire T1 core units are scavenger, sunstriders, thugs, firesworn, sunderer (with eruption and maybe mortar). Lets say you play on haladur and you are fighitng for the middle wells/orb cluster. If the nature guy drops this tower, almost all of the units above would be useless... It might be hard to pull of, because of eruption while building and so on, but if you get it up, its like almost unstoppable fire could just go sunderer, and life weaving or the sort before he goes in range of motk and destroy it. It's not really aggressive enough to justify spending 70 power. That's 70 power less than you can defend/fight with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilenceKiller99 Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 life weaving? in a fire T1? cool I dont know, you still have power to defend, if the fire guy has power for a sunderer + buffs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youto000 Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 how good would it be in PvE? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loptous Posted February 17, 2016 Author Share Posted February 17, 2016 43 minutes ago, youto000 said: how good would it be in PvE? Very good because the AI doesn't think like a human being ;D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youto000 Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Just now, Loptous said: Very good because the AI doesn't think like a human being ;D so the AI don't know how to position like a human Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpiritOfTheAbyss Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 I can't quite remember but is the ability activated as the motk is building? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youto000 Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 36 minutes ago, SpiritOfTheAbyss said: I can't quite remember but is the ability activated as the motk is building? i don't understand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LagOps Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 3 hours ago, SpiritOfTheAbyss said: I can't quite remember but is the ability activated as the motk is building? no the ability actives as soon as the building stands @Ultrakool sunderer is not quite effective. if the enemy has amazon, it won't do anything and if the enemy has swift claw, it can be used with root to kill sunderer. swift claw actually deals tons of damage if you can't force it back with ranged units. also a dryad sleep can help if the motk is still in construction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youto000 Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 it is mainly better as a PvE building Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loptous Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 Almost Friday my friends. Sooooo this card? Sometimes I hate random but oh well, at least we won't have to talk about again after. I just don't see the point in this card, you might as well save for juggernaut, brannoc, mo, etc. This card was obviously made to fill the role of a siege thingy. I just think it's a lazy design for a card that could of had more potential. Whatever though that's my opinion on that, what do you guys think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anonyme0273 Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 A fairly interesting card, not really "mainstream", but fun to use against someone who is still in T2 to knock around his units and an average good tank. Not really great, not really terrible... about average. In early T3, often XL units will be spawned to siege down bases or so, so L counters are fine against cards like Ashbones or other L armor type cards, but... not really sure worth the Power cost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilenceKiller99 Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 (edited) As you can see in this video, made by @Eirias , Virtuoso is actually viable as a siege unit. Although Juggernaut is not compared in the video, it wouldnt be fair either, because virtuoso is way cheaper than jugger. Also virtuoso is able to play in fire splashes, so you can support him with warriors death/life weaving (shadow splash) or homesoil (frost splash) or heals and cc (nature splash), while jugger is not and you only have dissenchant to support him really. Edited February 18, 2016 by SilenceKiller99 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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