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MrXLink

Current Proposal: Rewards

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dunno if there was already that suggestion but it will be nice if you add more quests to obtain booster packs during stress test.. progress will be reseted after some time so it that will be better for some people to obtain new cards at this moment

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they already obtaining much more cards that they will be obtaining after release, and they obtaining them for much easier quests :D

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alright, i have a suggestion. more packs. cracking packs open is fun. proven fact. its a loot box. currently, i am told that the devs think the BFP gain is too high and you want to lower the daily cap from 150+selling a pack for 400+. my suggestion, make packs unsellable, and increase their issuance via dailies or other activities. this would promote trading in the community (interaction) and gives players the ability to try out new decks and cards they otherwise wouldnt be able to try. 

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over 60% of players get over half of cards in first month of play...

what will you do after having all the cards with full charges? Stop playing the game, because there will be no more goal to reach? :thinking:

 

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8 hours ago, Kubik said:

over 60% of players get over half of cards in first month of play...

what will you do after having all the cards with full charges? Stop playing the game, because there will be no more goal to reach? :thinking:

 

I'm playing since several months and I don't even have NEARLY half of the cards I need. My calculation 3 months or something ago, where I said I'd need over a year, is still correct. So where do you have this number from? Are you just counting single cards and don't care about charges? :'D

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yes for that I did not count charges :P I just count unique cards, everyone start with 50 unique cards, so it is probably not most objective metric for most things, but to measure if players have chance to test cards I think it is good enough :P 

or you disagree on that? :thinking:

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16 minutes ago, Kubik said:

yes for that I did not count charges :P I just count unique cards, everyone start with 50 unique cards, so it is probably not most objective metric for most things, but to measure if players have chance to test cards I think it is good enough :P 

or you disagree on that? :thinking:

The problem is that you need a certain amount of charges to make deck works decently well. You can surely make them work somewhat, but thats a patchwork at best after all, especially for PvP.
If this was a completely new game i could even understand the progression rate at least somewhat. But BF is after all played by a lot of people who already know all of or at least most of the content anyways. To get all the cards necassary for competitive play is hard enough as is now. Playing through the game a 3rd or 4th time to get to the point where competition is actually evened out... well.
And fair enough, people knew that there would be a wipe and you didnt name a date for it. That was half a year ago though with no end in sight just yet. It just doesn't feel good at all to loose all the stuff of a game i know in and out for a 2nd time, just to start over completely.
I can understand that you want to give players who actually waiited a more even playing ground as they trusted that announcement. I feel like there were for the most part no major abuses of bugs or something. So the major problem is that the progression rate is currently enhanced.
To level the playing field a bit, i wouldnt even mind to not get bfp/gold/exp rewards for a couple of months, as long as my current progress isn't set back to 0. An option to choose to either keep your account and dont get/ get redcued rewards for x month or wipe the account would be nice. I am aware that is extra work and am not even sure how feasible that even is.
Just my current feeling about the plans ahead.
I would most definetly play significantly less at least until i got some of the necassary cards back.
 

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1 hour ago, Treim said:

...And fair enough, people knew that there would be a wipe and you didnt name a date for it. That was half a year ago though with no end in sight just yet. It just doesn't feel good at all to loose all the stuff of a game i know in and out for a 2nd time, just to start over completely...
 

I agree here. Team, just give us a date when the next reset will happen. But keep a reasonable temporal forerun like a month minimum at telling the date to the community, so people can run crazy spending their bfps, trying new cards/decks.

Cheers

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:thinking: ok sometime between next month and 2666 April 1. :thinking: that should be precise enough if you want some time frame, and give us enough time to finish it :P 

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5 hours ago, Festmahl said:

I agree here. Team, just give us a date when the next reset will happen. But keep a reasonable temporal forerun like a month minimum at telling the date to the community, so people can run crazy spending their bfps, trying new cards/decks.

Cheers

I think you misunderstood my intent there. I was asking not asking for a date but simply explaining circumstances. Announcing dates backfired big time (multiple times) which is why i understand that they dont do it anymore.
I wanted to clarify that i simply did not think it would take this long to reach the first wipe and with so much time passing, i would be quite disappointed to lose my progress. The difference in expectation and reality is not the mistake of the devs but probably a lack of understanding on how hard this would be on my end and maybe (or maybe not) some unforeseen issues on the devs side (?).
With the situation i and probably quite a few other players are in, starting over (again) is quite disappoiting, especially if you want to play the game competitively which requires a lot of cards and upgrades.
As I am now able to do that for at least most maps, which actually took me the last few months of intense playing and progression supposedly going down after the wipe, that is simply not a feasible alternative for me. I don't plan to play 8-10 months just to be able to play all speedruns.



P.s. Don't think i am whining here. just stating the situation as it is from my point of view. What you do with that is up to you.
 

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Posted (edited)
20 hours ago, Kubik said:

over 60% of players get over half of cards in first month of play...

what will you do after having all the cards with full charges? Stop playing the game, because there will be no more goal to reach? :thinking:

 

This is the problem the original BattleForge had. The problem is not enough content. If you want to avoid this dame problem, make more content. Making the game more grind heavy by making pack aquisition take longer will bring you to much the same problem. Too much effort and not enough return for time invested.

 

Your problem with people obtaining cards is not by getting them in packs. It is via people purchasing the cards they want with BFP via the auction house. Therefor your problem is BFP generation. If people cannot obtain BFP that quickly, they cannot purchase cards more quickly.

As the people on discord "politely" i formed me, you can amass BFP at a staggering rate per week via the dailies alloting you 150 bfp a day and 1 pack that you sell to players for 400+  BFP. You can reduce the BFP gain by 3/4 if you simply disable selling packs to players. If thats something you dont want to do, then you can simply reduce the cost of buying packs from the game store from 450 BFP to something lower. The market will adjust, and you can lower everyone's BFP gain that way as selling a pack is 3/4 of a players BFP gain.

To answer your question as far as what do i do once i obtain all cards and upgrades, and charges. What i would do is experiment with different deck ideas in both pvp and pve. 

The fun of battleforge (at least for me) is not only collecting cards, but deck building as well.  Of course there is actually playing the game as well. Everything i love about a CCG AND an RTS. I understand not everyone will like every aspect, but that is no reason to ignore an aspect of the game.

20 hours ago, Kubik said:

over 60% of players get over half of cards in first month of play...

what will you do after having all the cards with full charges? Stop playing the game, because there will be no more goal to reach? :thinking:

 

As i tried to have a conversation in discord about this, (THAT YOU NEED TO GO READ :P) players will progress at the game at different speeds. You will have some players who have their 1 deck in mind and go about getting those specific cards immediately, you can consider these the hardcore players. And then you have the casuals who will crack packs, not sell the packs for bfp, and work with what cards they have. What i think the current consensus is, is that you are making the rules while only considering the hardcore players. 

By doing this, you will drive away all the casuals. Admittedly on the converse, if you cater to only the casuals, you will drive away the hardcore. Find a happier medium. 

Edited by HeyWhoWhat

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You have open stress test to find which deck you want first...

I have bit of an discussion yesterday about how much of BattleForge I am able to edit, and the answer is LESS than 1%

Result of discussion was that I should remind players of that fact more often, because some think we successfully disassembled all of the Battleforge, which is not true.

MrXLink in Open Stress Test - All you need to know! said:

Quote

We can't emphasise enough that your late-night grinding sessions will not end up in the release build of Skylords Reborn, so mind that while scheduling your playtime!

So @Treim I understand your problem, but you was warmed that wipe will come.

Some players waiting only to final wipe to start, and it would not be fair that they would start with about nothing while some players would have keep their cards....

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16 hours ago, Kubik said:

:thinking: ok sometime between next month and 2666 April 1. :thinking: that should be precise enough if you want some time frame, and give us enough time to finish it :P 

That‘s not professional at all. Just write „sorry, but we don‘t have an estimation at the moment“ and everything would still be fine. But when you know an estimation for a planned wipe, tell it to the community.

 

How about this as a possible way to go:

- At the point the progress for each player will be wiped, just keep these accounts with their cards and decks

- Disable for these characters to purchase, trade, or earn cards and bfp. This gives these chars the possibility to do their pvp and speedrun stuff

- These accounts should be able to create a second char, but no more. In the classical Battleforge we were able to choose chars after the login screen

- Within the second char, everything like purchasing cards, trading, getting bfps and boosters for quests should be available/possible

- For those that create their account after the wipe, only one character may be created, not a second

Cheers

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sorry, about the joke, but answering same question 10-20 times per day "no we do not have any date for you, when we will we will tell you" with copy paste is too boring, I hope you can understand that...

but to your points:

  • I do not know how much you know about the technical part so I go with simple example
    • imagine a row of boxes numbered 1, 2, 3, 4... and ordered by these numbers these boxes contains information about each accounts
    • next imagine if it is faster to go to box with number 23456, while you go around these boxes that was not used
    • or the alternative is that we create new row that will have only 20000 boxes total
    • there is performance penalty for having bunch of inactive users, or deleted users, because you can not reuse these numbers, we have 1000s of those because of multiaccounting :( 
  • all characters on one account share BFP, that limitation EA left there, with mostly invalidate rest of your points, because without BFP/cards they would not be able to change their decks, because no one have 4 copies of each card

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Posted (edited)

If the market was fair and stable and the progress way faster, I think most players wouldn't have a problem to regrind the cards. It may be true that some people would lose interest after obtaining all cards 1x including promos, but I don't think that most core players share this opinion. At least for all PvP players I can tell for sure, that they START their actual progression when they have 4x every card they need. PvE players that add any value to the community also most oftenly need more than 1 charge of enlightenment, infect, and so on. So I don't really get who constructed this whole idea of how fast the progression should be in his/her opinion, but it clearly doesn't work out for the community. There have been a lot of suggestions so I assume you, dear Skylords Team, will figure out what will work in the long run. Just gotta start listening to the right people :p

Edit: Looking at some statements in this thread, I want to add that the team clearly tried to make a compromise between hardcore and casual players. It just doesn't work the way it's meant to be due to multiaccounting and the VERY different goals and speeds of the players.

Edited by Navarr

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22 hours ago, Kubik said:

You have open stress test to find which deck you want first...

I have bit of an discussion yesterday about how much of BattleForge I am able to edit, and the answer is LESS than 1%

to your first point, you are missing the entire point of what i am saying.

to your second point, the daily quests are part of what can be modified, correct? that is what i am suggesting to be modified.

i am happy and i thank you for your replies Kubik. I want to say that i am suggesting things here so that not only you can see, but the entire Dev team. so please dont think i am just B*tching at you ;)

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Posted (edited)

First of all thx again for your awesome work bringing bf back and allready improoving it.

OK now I'm curious. Any information about what is part of that 1 % u can edit now woud be interesting.

Not in detail like patchnotes just gereral. I know the updates moved to discord only, but I think more of a summary . 

For example "... Is not priority now" (change cards) as stated often for me sounds like we could. Or is it, we maybe can in the future, or we have no idea if its ever possible. 

And if u willing to answer you shoud consider make an extra Topic for this and stick it. I think it will prevent manny questions and suggestions.

 

 

Kind Regards

Edited by Karl Lavafeld

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if you want extra topic you should create it :P

I am not good at writing long texts (almost) no one will read, so if you have specific question just ask.

Editing cards is possible, but we did not test it yet. Main problem here is that we do not want to break the game with card changes, so each change will be discussed in the team and with player to be as sure as possible it do not break anything else, and then tested before moving live of course...

One of multiple things I focusing on right now is improving anticheat, I always know we identified only small parts of the game, but when I did much deeper analysis for the AC my metric showed it was actually less than 0.5% month or two back :o

So when we launch Open Stress Test I have no idea about more than 99.5 % of the game :huh: and it was enough to make it "somehow" work for 100s of players :) 

It is really interesting how little is needed to get started :) 

If you have more specific questions, I may consider checking with Fiki if I can answer them, so do not worry if some do not get answers quickly :)

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Thx @Kubik nice to hear. For me that 0,5 % u can edit allready feels like 80% if it includes card changes. No more questions for now from my side. 

I can't imagine what the other 99,5% could be. Turn Bf into a shooter? Or Bf meets street fighter? Just foolin around here... 

All I wish for Bf server is stable all cards that are in the game are somehow viable and balanced and featured community maps with loot (more pve content). 

Since beginning of stress test you improved the game allready a lot.

Kind regards

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On ‎3‎/‎16‎/‎2019 at 12:47 PM, Irysunna said:

Then the new players will stay, and old one will quit. I wonder which side has the most members :)

True words. I dont can understand players that wait until the game is "finished" - they should be part of the battleforge community now and not later. If you love this game you want to be a part of the restart from the beginning and dont wait years until the work is done by other players....

 

Btw we are talking about a game that was released 2009 - i dont want to play a lot of months really slow to get content that i already know for nearly 8 years. Better focus to bring new content in e.g. rework of existing cards , new maps etc.. in future.

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6 minutes ago, Pritstift said:

True words. I dont can understand players that wait until the game is "finished" - they should be part of the battleforge community now and not later. If you love this game you want to be a part of the restart from the beginning and dont wait years until the work is done by other players....

 

Btw we are talking about a game that was released 2009 - i dont want to play a lot of months really slow to get content that i already know for nearly 8 years. Better focus to bring new content in e.g. rework of existing cards , new maps etc.. in future.

Why? I actually know a lot of people that don't play and rather wait for the next reset and an update of the quest system. For different reasons. Some don't play games that have daily quests cuz it interferes with their time management. Some don't like bugs and crashes and wait for everything to be as stable as possible. Some just want to start at the same time as everybody else cuz they missed the Stress Test start.

The second part of your post is damn right tho.

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Kubik said:

:thinking: @Pritstift I still can not understand it, may you try to explain it in more detail why new content is more important to you than server crashes?

I am not saying that new content is more important than server crashes. I am saying that is makes no sence to make the game progess slow to get cards and content that we know for years. So for me it is ok to have most of the cards after three months of intensive playing. A lot of players here invest a lot of energy to create ideas how to make the game progress and getting new cards really slow - i dont like this from my point of view.

 

Quote

Why? I actually know a lot of people that don't play and rather wait for the next reset and an update of the quest system. For different reasons. Some don't play games that have daily quests cuz it interferes with their time management. Some don't like bugs and crashes and wait for everything to be as stable as possible. Some just want to start at the same time as everybody else cuz they missed the Stress Test start.

But this players are not really useful for the final release of the game - they should invest now the time they can to make the game now better and help the devs to find bugs etc. In my opinion the devs did a great job until now and the game has not a lot of crashes - also the daily quest system makes it easy to get some good cards and bfp without investing a lot of time.

Edited by Pritstift
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"not a lot of crashes" our definition obviously differ a bit :P 

Just some math if you will have all cards 4 copies after 3 months that is about 2100 cards (rounded down to better number :P ) that mean after half a year we will have 84000000 cards no one will want, because they will already have them, and that is over 4,38 TB of raw data (not counting any reference data and ordering data, and index data....).

Some players like collecting which would make their interest in game 3 months long. Which would even increase amount of the dead cards.

also did not count booster distribution, because most cards are commons which would make again even more dead cards in DB.

That much DEAD data does not seem good to me.

What do you think about these numbers?

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